How could I share my concern about university ranking with a potential supervisor?

Question

I have a master's degree from a university outside of Canada. I recently decided to apply for Ph.D. in Canada and I found a potential supervisor, I like his research area, he has more industrial research projects going on. I like the fact that he gets projects from the industry, and his personality itself.

I am only concerned about the ranking of the university which is low. I just do not like to study in a university that has a bad ranking. I definitely do not know a lot about the university, I just looked up the ranking on the internet. It is a smaller university. Would ranking matter when studying for a Ph.D.? Should I choose this university for a PhD. or should I move on? and search for universities with a better ranking?

I came to know this professor has good collaboration with a few good ranking universities, would that be possible that I share my concern with him and ask him about the possibility of having admission to a better ranking university but also having him as a supervisor/co-supervisor? Would that be rude to ask?

Answer 1

It's not a good idea to talk about ranking with a potential supervisor, because it can easily offend (example). This is for a few reasons:

• Some professors genuinely hate rankings.
• The ranking is not something the supervisor can directly control. The entire university is ranked, and they are but one professor in the university.
• You are implicitly using the university ranking to rank the professor. It's possible there's a correlation (I don't have the data, but I suspect there should be a correlation) but it's still similar to saying "your brother is a criminal so your integrity is suspect too" - see association fallacy - and people can react badly.
• You send the message that you don't consider them to have had a good career since they're currently at a low-ranked university.
• What do you expect them to say? You ought to know what the university's ranking is before you talk to the professor, and if ranking matters to you, you shouldn't approach them in the first place.

I do think that all things equal there are good reasons to go to the higher-ranked university: the more prestigious institution is more likely to have comprehensive facilities, better journal access, more distinguished visiting academics, etc., and most importantly, better students. Graduate study isn't a solo activity; the presence of other good students can have a huge impact on your development. Higher rank also means a lot if you intend to work in industry after the PhD; even if you don't intend to, it's still nice to have a fallback.

But it's not something to discuss with the prospective supervisor. If you want to talk to an academic about it, ask your undergraduate professors.

See related questions:

• PhD - Well known professor or well known school?
• How much should university ranking matter while choosing a place for graduate studies?
• University rank/stature - How much does it affect one's career post-Ph.D?

Answer 2

The ranking of the university should be quite irrelevant to you as an individual: what matters is what you do. In other words, there is good (and very good) research done everywhere, and there is bad research done everywhere also. The rankings are affected by all kinds of “meta” factors that have no connection with the quality of research of this faculty member.

In practice, you are more likely to find active researchers at higher-ranked institutions, but you are past that as you found a prospective supervisor already.

Of course, you can inquire about co-supervisions but that’s quite a bit trickier as this faculty member would (likely) need an adjunct appointment elsewhere, and would need to find someone else with the same interests to co-supervise.

Thus, if the project seems of interest to you, and the conditions of the thesis look reasonable, try talking to other graduate students of the group (if any); if all of this is positive, go for it.

Answer 3

ask him about the possibility of having admission to a better ranking university

Do not. It is unlikely that your potential supervisor can do anything about admission to another university.

Answer 4

The only relevant thing is your employment after PhD. If you get PhD from McGill or UToronto, you probably will have more chances. But a lot depends on the reputation ("ranking" if you wish) of your supervisor. The potential supervisor probably had other students who got their PhD. You should check where these students are now.

Answer 5

I don't think you can talk about the ranking of the university to the potential supervisor. This can be very damaging to your relationship, and quite offending to the supervisor knowing that you look down on him/her or their institute.

You should probably see if you have an alternative in a "better" university and decide based on the project, university, supervisor, and future prospects accordingly.

Comment: while rankings can definitely sometimes be misleading (with a small difference in ranking being meaningless), a university ranked 900 almost always will have much less research infrastructure than one ranked in the top 100.

Answer 6

I came to know this professor has good collaboration with a few good ranking universities, would that be possible that I share my concern with him and ask him about the possibility of having admission to a better ranking university but also having him as a supervisor/co-supervisor? Would that be rude to ask?

You can try. Most likely you won’t get a response (and you might get blocked automatically if your message isn't from a reputable .edu domain. We get a lot of unwanted academic spam, especially from foreign countries).

If you do get a response and the professor isn’t offended, it'll probably look something like "Sure. First get admitted into this much more selective institution then come back".

Regarding your question on ranking, there’s a few things things to consider.

Some smaller universities prefer to focus on a few super star researchers in one or two areas of expertise, but have their ranking computed on all their research output. Think of CMU in computer science for instance.

If you are looking at a University in the French part of the country, the situation is a little bit different. French Canadians are notorious for wanting to return home, and I’ve seen guys take a massive drop in institutional ranking to get a chance to move back home. I collaborate frequently with someone who did exactly that (from a top 10 institution here in the US to where he completed did his undergrad in Montreal). He’s still technically on an “extended sabbatical leave” but it’s clear he’s getting tenure over there relatively soon.

It’s especially true in AI, with researchers like Yoshua Bengio being clear that he’ll collaborate with everyone interested but won’t relocate whatsoever. I’ve not observed the same pattern elsewhere in Canada, however.

Answer 7

Join this university. Choose projects that not only have value in the industry but also are academically significant and prestigious. Work like a beaver to produce stellar results and publish famous and often-cited papers. Raise the ranking of the university from 26 to 25.

Don't think you can do it? Then go join university number 97.